Will / Should Texas secede?

JDH

http://www.star-telegram.com/2012/11/20/4429851/a-peaceful-texas-secession-would.html

Discuss.....

beatnic

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

JDH

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

0patience

I'm surprised at how much people think that states get federal funding. Highway funds are minimal at best.
In most cases, the federal funding is for primary highways/freeways.
In some states, it only amounts to 10% of their total highway funding.

Texas has an economy equal to most countries. I'm not sure how their economy would fail without the federal input. I may be missing something though.

JDH

0patience:

I'm surprised at how much people think that states get federal funding. Highway funds are minimal at best.
In most cases, the federal funding is for primary highways/freeways.
In some states, it only amounts to 10% of their total highway funding.

Texas has an economy equal to most countries. I'm not sure how their economy would fail without the federal input. I may be missing something though.

Have you driven much in Dalas or Fort Worth, or Austin, or San Antonio, or Houston? There are mega bucks of Federal highway dollars there.

0patience

JDH:

Have you driven much in Dalas or Fort Worth, or Austin, or San Antonio, or Houston? There are mega bucks of Federal highway dollars there.

Based on what? Based on their highways?
Are you assuming that because it's a highway, it has federal dollars for the upkeep and construction?
That isn't always the case. Federal highway dollars are based on a lot of things.
Oregon as an example sees federal highway dollars for a portion of the interstates. Not much else after that. And that portion is limited.

Don't assume that an interstate is totally federally funded. It's not.

JDH

http://www.window.state.tx.us/comptrol/fnotes/fn1204/pdf/FN_I35_0412.pdf

0patience

132 billion dollars for 2010 is the exception, not the rule.
Evidently, Texas has gotten the lion's share of federal highway dollars. That is interesting to know.
I stand corrected.
Most states do not see that kind of revenue.

But what would I know. It's not like I work for DOT or anything.
Oh wait. I do.

beatnic

JDH:

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

You are very good at predicting the future. Have you ever lived in Texas?

JDH

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

You are very good at predicting the future. Have you ever lived in Texas?

I was born in Austin. I was raised in East Texas. I have family and friends who still live in the Austin, College Station, Ft. Worth, and Nacogdoches areas. I visit at least twice every year.

beatnic

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

You are very good at predicting the future. Have you ever lived in Texas?

I was born in Austin. I was raised in East Texas. I have family and friends who still live in the Austin, College Station, Ft. Worth, and Nacogdoches areas. I visit at least twice every year.

Then you know their capabilities. You don't think they could survive on their own?

JDH

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

You are very good at predicting the future. Have you ever lived in Texas?

I was born in Austin. I was raised in East Texas. I have family and friends who still live in the Austin, College Station, Ft. Worth, and Nacogdoches areas. I visit at least twice every year.

Then you know their capabilities. You don't think they could survive on their own?

I think it would become a social darwinist hell hole with a very small percentage of exceedingly rich people and most everybody else competing for living standards with Mexico, China, India, and Vietnam without any social safety net whatsoever. It would be a 21st Century version of a plantation economy, except the owners would have no responsibility for the welfare or housing of its workers.

beatnic

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

You are very good at predicting the future. Have you ever lived in Texas?

I was born in Austin. I was raised in East Texas. I have family and friends who still live in the Austin, College Station, Ft. Worth, and Nacogdoches areas. I visit at least twice every year.

Then you know their capabilities. You don't think they could survive on their own?

I think it would become a social darwinist hell hole with a very small percentage of exceedingly rich people and most everybody else competing for living standards with Mexico, China, India, and Vietnam without any social safety net whatsoever. It would be a 21st Century version of a plantation economy, except the owners would have no responsibility for the welfare or housing of its workers.

That wouldn't be good for a socialist, would it?

JDH

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

Aint gonna happen in this political environment. However, with all of the petitions being generated across the nation, I think that it will lead to legislators into siding with more "State's Rights" issues in the near future. That is good. And a side point to Texas, they could do it successfully. They have their own farming, ranching, industries, oil, and refineries. Additionally, Texas has its' own power grid.

Within three years of secession it would be the northern most province of Mexico. The oil would be sold on the world market to benefit the oil companies, not Texas, because the libertairians hate taxes. The drout (climate change) is going to destroy Texas farming and agriculture, and without any Federal dollars, Texas would loose all military bases and economic support they bring, along with NASA, Customs and the Federal Border Police, the FBI, all Federal highway funds, all Federal support for the Universities and schools and hospitals and airports. When the next hurricane hits and wipes out a large chunk of, let's say, Houston, there would be no help from the Federal Government, and since the Libertarians hate taxes, individuals and businesses would be left to fend for themselves. There would be no more Social Security, no Medicare of Medicaide, no social safety net whatsoever, which is going to leave a huge number of Texans living in dire poverty with no means of support, and the USA would slap an economic blockade against it that would make the Cubans feel like they were living in a resort. All the smart people with means would leave, and that would leave a very small number of incredibly rich people and millions of very poor people, most of whom "hate the guvermint", and won't put up with much law at all. Then the Mexicans would re-claim it.

You are very good at predicting the future. Have you ever lived in Texas?

I was born in Austin. I was raised in East Texas. I have family and friends who still live in the Austin, College Station, Ft. Worth, and Nacogdoches areas. I visit at least twice every year.

Then you know their capabilities. You don't think they could survive on their own?

I think it would become a social darwinist hell hole with a very small percentage of exceedingly rich people and most everybody else competing for living standards with Mexico, China, India, and Vietnam without any social safety net whatsoever. It would be a 21st Century version of a plantation economy, except the owners would have no responsibility for the welfare or housing of its workers.

That wouldn't be good for a socialist, would it?

Since I'm not a socialist, I couldn't say, but it certainly wouldn't be good for anyone who works for a wage or salary, that's for sure.

Vulchor

No they wont. No they shouldnt. Ill leave it at that for now, lol.

Knoxca1

That's for the people in Texas to decide. Since I'm not a resident of Texas it doesn't affect me.

Amos Umwhat

I'm going to say no, and no, to the original question. I've lived there a couple times, graduated High School there, and I'm a Tennesseean, the folks that primarily were responsible for liberating Texas. I think Beatnic makes some good points about the nature of Texans. They are smart, tough, and independent, and will not lessen themselves or their status by seceding.

phobicsquirrel

The social framework of this country has sank back from the rest of the developed world. Sure it hasn't gone away completely yet but the way the corporate level has pushed into our lives and even gets defended by every day people is scary. Texas may make it if they succeed. However the non rich would be heavily taxed and the standards of living would plummet. They wouldn't get any assistance, from the FED, they would be cut off from the rest of the states and would the world accept them? Also what they did in their state would effect other states with their pollution.

I really don't see why this country takes so long to move in the direction of the future. We are still having debates on whether a woman can say no to having kids. We are actually entertaining the notion that rich people should keep super low rates when people making peanuts get taxed higher. There are people saying that SS age needs to be raised but no one says maybe the cap should be lifted? We still have people trying to keep citizens from getting healthcare in favor of profits for the insurance companies. In a lot of ways this country has moved fallen from grace as far as countries go. We as a country need to really fix ourselves and become united again.

beatnic

All over the spectrum there, Phobic.

phobicsquirrel

beatnic:

All over the spectrum there, Phobic.

I know