pg solution vs distilled water

AQUADGIO1200

Hey fellas i had a question.....I have a 150 count humi w/about 100 smokes in it @ the moment. It originaly came 3 humi cartriges (2 long small ones & 1 large rectangle). When i first got the humi, i soaked them in distilled water & they worked fine untill my RH was @ 76-77 contantly for 1 week. So i took out the big cartrige & small ones and replaced it with one Zikar Crystal Gel Jar and it worked wonders...the RH then was stable @ 65-66RH. Wanting to achieve the 70rh i added back the two small humi cartriges after soaking them in distilled water, withing a day the RH got to 70-71rh. So now i have one Zikar Gel jar and two small long humi cartriges to achieve the 70rh level. My question is....i hear people using PG solution on their cartriges instead of distilled water. Should start using PG solution in the cartriges? Is the PG more stable? Easier to maintain 70ish rh levels? Now the Zikar Jar that i bought was already pre-filled with solution and i can see the crystal gels shrinking now that its been in the humi for 2-3 weeks....& per Zikar instructions (must add pg sol when @ it reaches the add indicator). So whats the deal with PG over distilled water? Thanks guys for your input

mustluvcigars

I am new to this too, so I speak not from expience, but from what I have gathered from sudying the subject on these boards and other websites----- It is my understanding that the PG 50/50 is a hydrosopic liquid working quite similiar to the beads and crystals in as much that they are chemically engineered to to only hold or release as much moisture as they are rated, the straight PG 50/50 is suppossed to hold at 70% RH the crystal or beads come in different levels between 65% and 72%,, also the PG has anti-bacterial and anti-mold properties as well, I am sure that is why it is recommended or suggested over just plain distilled water.. I have found that you can purchase non-diluted PG from variuos websites, guessing you could purchse there and dilute to 50/50 with distilled waters and make several hundred dollars worth of the stuff they sell at cigar shops.

madurofan

mustluvcigars:

also the PG has anti-bacterial and anti-mold properties as well

This is the main reason for using it. I've also heard claims that it doesn't evaporate as quickly as water.

My suggestion though is to get rid of the cartridges altogether. Take a look at the beads on this site or check out a Cigar Oasis. A lot of people have had very good success with the beads, I personally find them a little erratic so I use them with another product like the Xikar jar you have. But me, I'd never use one of those cartridges, no matter what you do it WILL mold.

kuzi16

geeez maddy!! cant figure out how to work beads....


j/k
the beads are a product that i fully recommend. I have about twice as much in my humi as i need. needless to say i dont have to refill them (distilled only) very often.
as far as mold in the humidification system goes....
never had a problem with beads.

dutyje

In order to understand the effect of plain distilled water in your cartridges, sponges, or whatever you're using, you need to understand basic osmosis. This is simple. Water molecules will be motivated to disperse until full equilibrium is attained. That is, if I set a dish of distilled water in an empty humidor, that water will slowly evaporate until full equilibrium is attained (100% rH). There is nothing to stop this.

A PG solution (up to 50% distilled water, and 50% propylene glycol) will release moisture into the air when the ambient humidity is below 70% rH. It will not release moisture into the air when the rH is above 70%. That's both important and convenient with respect to our hobby.

There is nothing inherently magical about a PG solution that makes it resistant to mold. Instead, it is its tendency to retain moisture at rH above 70% that prevents mold, as mold will only occur at higher (75+?) rH.

Back when I researched all this, I had also read that you could put PG solution in your sponges, and then re-charge once or twice with pure distilled water. Using PG solution over and over again will eventually give you a sponge soaked with PG, and no real ability to hold pure water. But this is where our formerly on-hand chemist would have come in handy. I use beads. 3x the recommended amount is excellent.

madurofan

Thanks duty. I'd never researched PG but now I'm glad I know.

dutyje

Just keep in mind that whole post was top-of-my-head.. based off research I did a year ago. Like Jozer, I'm passing it off as fact

gmill880

Thanks for that post duty that was interesting ...

laker1963

Just in addition to what Duty stated... the Heartfelt site says to NOT use the 50/50 solution with the beads as eventually you will ruin the beads. Likely the same effects Duty mentioned with the sponges, in that the beads would become saturated with the 50/50 solution and they would lose their ability to absorb moisture.
A question for the experts. Do you guys use one standard of beads or a combination of them?
I was thinking of adding equal amounts of the 65 % and the 70% beads in order to acheive an RH of around 67% which is about the moisture level I like in my cigars. Would this work do you think? It should.
Right now I use the 67% humi pillows (multiple) and they work fine, but tend to take up too much space in the humi.

madurofan

I use only the 70% and just charge less of them, but my beads fluctuate anywhere between 62 and 72.

I know a few people do mix and match, I believe duty does.

dutyje

I currently have a tube of 70% and a tube of 65%. The 70% dries out, while the 65% beads stay clear. My humidity has been in the 65-70% range, but I don't think you'd ever see a true "compromise" if you split half and half. The 70% will discharge water until the humidity is at 70%. The 65% will (in theory) absorb moisture until they are saturated. I only introduced the 70% this winter when my humi was having a difficult time maintaining rH above 60% without re-charging every 5 days or so. I am currently re-charging the tube of 70% about every 7-10 days, and the 65% every 2-3 weeks.

I have a water pillow and a tube of 65% beads in a tupperdor. The beads pretty much stay charged all the time, and I re-charge the pillow about every 3 weeks. Again, the item which is supposed to maintain a higher humidity will be sapped before you tap into the lower-humidity item.

So, to answer your question, Laker -- no.