Another Stupid Law

Alex Svenson

This isnt cigar related but I am still fired up about the over reach of government taking away our choices (New MD cigar law in particular). I just picked up the local paper today here my town and one of the alderman is pushing for a law that would ban all disposable shopping bags. No more paper or plastic. We would be forced to buy the reusable ones. I live in a pretty retail intensive area with everything from a borders to a game stop. This is ridiculous. A law that requires me to buy something?? I fancy myself a good steward of the environment and use the reusable stuff as much as I can but to not have the option is downright over reaching.

Russ55

That is stupid. Around here there are stores that offer a small discount on your purchases if you use the reusable bags, which is the smart way to do it I think. You don't force it on people, you give them a reason to want to do it themselves, and if they don't they don't. You just be satisfied that the option is there, and more do it now than before.

stephen_hannibal

Hell in MD they tried to tax plastic bags... I kid you not.

alienmisprint

That is ridiculous, how can that possibly be legal?

Knoxca1

It's amazing to see how much the government feels it needs to make our decisions for us. It's not even surprising anymore to see them propose laws banning soda. Pretty sad really.

xmacro

The Gov't always knows what's best - why should mere peons disagree with the panels of experts who know better than the free market? From Obamacare to plastic bags - the Gov't and their experts always propose to know what's better for people than people themselves

phobicsquirrel

Alex Svenson:

This isnt cigar related but I am still fired up about the over reach of government taking away our choices (New MD cigar law in particular). I just picked up the local paper today here my town and one of the alderman is pushing for a law that would ban all disposable shopping bags. No more paper or plastic. We would be forced to buy the reusable ones. I live in a pretty retail intensive area with everything from a borders to a game stop. This is ridiculous. A law that requires me to buy something?? I fancy myself a good steward of the environment and use the reusable stuff as much as I can but to not have the option is downright over reaching.

There is something like this in Oregon, either passed already or is pending. However it only goes for plastic bags. The sticker of the deal is that retail stores are wanting a tax or a fee that goes to the store as paper bags are more expensive. Or you could just buy one of there re-usable bags.

I can understand it as it will cut down on garbage and all but at the same time paper is still being used. And I'm not sure about this but I assume most stores won't be too happy if you use your "own" shopping bag.

phobicsquirrel

xmacro:

The Gov't always knows what's best - why should mere peons disagree with the panels of experts who know better than the free market? From Obamacare to plastic bags - the Gov't and their experts always propose to know what's better for people than people themselves

dude, really? obamacare is much better than what's in place now. do some research buddy.

rossdavey2

Back home the main food stores starting a small charge for a bag like .02 pretty soon every one was just bringing their own. A few people freaked out, but it really did work in the long run. Less trash laying around.

Joeyjoe21_8

In CA they tried to pass the tax on that to charge us...we told the govt to F off...

Ken Light

This is terrible from the perspective that it is degenerating our freedom, for sure.

But you might be interested to know it is also terrible for both the environment and the health of the general public. In the case of the environment, it takes approximately 100x the plastic/energy/resources to make a reusable plastic bag as it does a standard one. That means you have to use that 100 times just to break even with the environmental effects (maybe less, it should be noted that 100 standard bags is more waste than 1 reusable bag). If you shop for groceries once a week, that's nearly 2 years of use from one bag. In California specifically it has been demonstrated that people often do not reuse these bags even once. And CA is supposed to be environmentally conscious, so that's probably better than other places. But even if you use these things 100 times...

That brings me to point number 2: health risks. Bacteria are on everything in a supermarket, even on packaged goods, but enormously on produce and meat. That means that technically we should be washing these bags each and every time we use them unless we want to get sick. That's bad...but the solution is worse...

Back to the environment again. Washing these things puts chemicals into the ground water. And preventing bacteria in the first place? Well that would require we use...you guessed it, plastic bags to pack up produce and meat (most people do that already) and these wouldn't be able to be re-usable...or they'd have to be washed...and you get the idea from there, right?

Russ55

Ken Light:

This is terrible from the perspective that it is degenerating our freedom, for sure.

But you might be interested to know it is also terrible for both the environment and the health of the general public. In the case of the environment, it takes approximately 100x the plastic/energy/resources to make a reusable plastic bag as it does a standard one. That means you have to use that 100 times just to break even with the environmental effects (maybe less, it should be noted that 100 standard bags is more waste than 1 reusable bag). If you shop for groceries once a week, that's nearly 2 years of use from one bag. In California specifically it has been demonstrated that people often do not reuse these bags even once. And CA is supposed to be environmentally conscious, so that's probably better than other places. But even if you use these things 100 times...

That brings me to point number 2: health risks. Bacteria are on everything in a supermarket, even on packaged goods, but enormously on produce and meat. That means that technically we should be washing these bags each and every time we use them unless we want to get sick. That's bad...but the solution is worse...

Back to the environment again. Washing these things puts chemicals into the ground water. And preventing bacteria in the first place? Well that would require we use...you guessed it, plastic bags to pack up produce and meat (most people do that already) and these wouldn't be able to be re-usable...or they'd have to be washed...and you get the idea from there, right?

I've heard this too. It makes sense. My wife uses the reusable ones at places like CVS for our non food stuff. Occasionally she uses the reusable ones for food, but places meat and produce in the plastic bag before placing it in the reusable one. Then she washes the bag in the washer. I don't want my family sick, oh and of course I want that discount from the store!

PuroFreak

phobicsquirrel:

xmacro:

The Gov't always knows what's best - why should mere peons disagree with the panels of experts who know better than the free market? From Obamacare to plastic bags - the Gov't and their experts always propose to know what's better for people than people themselves

dude, really? obamacare is much better than what's in place now. do some research buddy.

Really? So insurance and medical costs in general sky rocketing, decreased number of Dr's, and govt. enforced penalties for not having insurance is better? Hmmmm... We have a very different definition of better obviously.

Schrooz

In California they charge a redemption value for buying items contained in recyclable material. The motive behind it is that it forces individuals to redeem the cost by recycling. #*)(Q!@*U&amp!. I have no time to go to a recycling place and for $0.60 that was added on to my 12-pack of beer!!!! I do have time to take the bottles and put them in the appropriate recycling bin. !*()(*&U*(!@#!~!!!!!! That $0.60 adds up over time. It would probably cost me more to get it back given the cost of gas and furthermore I am not going to waste space storing bottles of beer just to save gas . It all reeks of a scam. Like my bank, Wells Fargo... Last time I was at the branch some young recent college grad with her boobs popping out of her low cut shirt told me to open a new checking account so I can use it for on-line purchases as an additional safety measure against fraud. So I did. Seemed a good idea. I'd only use the related debit card on certain expenses so I can have a better understanding of my spending ways. Holly sheehayoot! Bad idea. Monthly service charge is a frigging $10. That's $120/year I could spend on cigars!!! No frigging way! I just closed the account a couple of days ago. Beware of banks.

Ken Light

phobicsquirrel:

xmacro:

The Gov't always knows what's best - why should mere peons disagree with the panels of experts who know better than the free market? From Obamacare to plastic bags - the Gov't and their experts always propose to know what's better for people than people themselves

dude, really? obamacare is much better than what's in place now. do some research buddy.

Obamacare IS what's in place now...

Amos Umwhat

Ken Light:

phobicsquirrel:

xmacro:

The Gov't always knows what's best - why should mere peons disagree with the panels of experts who know better than the free market? From Obamacare to plastic bags - the Gov't and their experts always propose to know what's better for people than people themselves

dude, really? obamacare is much better than what's in place now. do some research buddy.

Obamacare IS what's in place now...

No, not until 2014. What's happening now is the insurance industry cashing in while they can, take the money and run. There's a long history of this in the Health Care industry, check out the record of the current governor of Florida, who, by the way, is spending most of his efforts funneling tax-payer money into the companies he (excuse me, his Wife) owns.

Joeyjoe21_8

they messed u around bro.....if u link a acct to another free account then its free...i have 4..yes 4 accts with wells fargo ..2 checkings (one personal, one to pay bills out of), 2 savings, (1 retirement acct, 1 rainy day fund), and dont pay a dime for anything....at all. And dont be mad at the boobs...they did nothing to u! lol

Vulchor

Amos Umwhat:

Ken Light:

phobicsquirrel:

xmacro:

The Gov't always knows what's best - why should mere peons disagree with the panels of experts who know better than the free market? From Obamacare to plastic bags - the Gov't and their experts always propose to know what's better for people than people themselves

dude, really? obamacare is much better than what's in place now. do some research buddy.

Obamacare IS what's in place now...

No, not until 2014. What's happening now is the insurance industry cashing in while they can, take the money and run. There's a long history of this in the Health Care industry, check out the record of the current governor of Florida, who, by the way, is spending most of his efforts funneling tax-payer money into the companies he (excuse me, his Wife) owns.

Amos, the current Governor on my state should get the same ****** on here that curse words do-----luckily, he will be a one-termer and I do not think it will last even that long (hoping anyway)................on Alex's topic...stupid law indeed