Nitrogen/Vacuum Packing

perkinke · February 2014

A website that I found in Europe offers vacuum packing or nitrogen packing for its orders, I was curious if anyone has used these methods or if y'all have any idea of the benefits and drawbacks?

allsmokedup · February 2014

Vacuum obviates air and nitrogen displaces it. Air stores humidityallows its transmission... I guess science isn't so hot these days.

perkinke · February 2014

allsmokedup:
Vacuum obviates air and nitrogen displaces it. Air stores humidityallows its transmission... I guess science isn't so hot these days.

Yeah, I know what both of them do, the question was whether it be beneficial to have the exact level of humidity in the cigar preserved at the time of it's packaging via the vacuum packaging (similar to the way meat is transported long distances)? Would the nitrogen replacement of the oxygen, thus disrupting the maturation cycle for a few days and potentially eliminating the environmental conditions necessary for parasitic or fungal growth be a beneficial action or would it affect their flavors, or are these just gimmicks.

Lee.mcglynn · February 2014

Vacume I can see nitrogen will actually dry the sticks out!

Rain · February 2014

allsmokedup:
Vacuum obviates air and nitrogen displaces it. Air stores humidityallows its transmission... I guess science isn't so hot these days.

You're just happy you got to type obviate. The United States ranks from 20 to 27th on a mean performance on science scale. So no......we don't science, bro.

perkinke · February 2014

Rain:
allsmokedup:
Vacuum obviates air and nitrogen displaces it. Air stores humidityallows its transmission... I guess science isn't so hot these days.
You're just happy you got to type obviate. The United States ranks from 20 to 27th on a Mean Performance scale. So no......we don't science, bro.

Some of us do, my first two years of college I worked as a chemist trainee for a Dow subsidiary who rented space on campus as well as taught freshman chemistry. i also did a short stint at the Umatilla Chemical Warfare Depot when I was an ROTC cadet. But, none of that included experimenting with packing methods for cigars.

Rain · February 2014

perkinke:
I worked as a chemist trainee for a Dow subsidiary who rented space on campus as well as taught freshman chemistry. i also did a short stint at the Umatilla Chemical Warfare Depot when I was an ROTC cadet.

Mind.....blown.

Gray4lines · February 2014

Perkinke, I've seen a few of these shipping methods too. I have the same questions... I don't see how packing with nitrogen would help anything. Cigars aren't like bags of chips!

Vacuum? Ok, so you can seal it and the air won't suck any more humidity out of the cigars.

Water pillows just seem so much easier.

perkinke · February 2014

Gray4lines:
Perkinke, I've seen a few of these shipping methods too. I have the same questions... I don't see how packing with nitrogen would help anything. Cigars aren't like bags of chips!

Vacuum? Ok, so you can seal it and the air won't suck any more humidity out of the cigars.

Water pillows just seem so much easier.

One thing that worried me with the vacuum was wondering whether if they used too quick a vacuum if it would compress the cigars and damage the wrappers. probably not, but still. With nitro I like that idea a bit more, but wonder about the effect of nitro penetrating the cigars and if they would need to be outgassed or purged somehow. Given the relatively small volume of cigar boxes, probably not a big deal with that little gas, but still, i'm curious.

catfishbluezz · February 2014

Well...that place normally takes about 5 days to get to you. So really, it's not a big deal either way unless it gets held up. I'd say their choice of getting the boveda pack is much safer.

macs-smokes · February 2014

The only benefit I can think of for nitrogen... is kill beetles. Lack of oxygen... other than that... meh

Lee.mcglynn · February 2014

catfishbluezz:
Well...that place normally takes about 5 days to get to you. So really, it's not a big deal either way unless it gets held up. I'd say their choice of getting the boveda pack is much safer.

+1 and R's cs is great!

perkinke · February 2014

Thanks guys, my recent bout with mold made me take a second look at these two things. and "R" huh? Mine was a "P"...

FireRob · February 2014

perkinke:
but wonder about the effect of nitro penetrating the cigars and if they would need to be outgassed or purged somehow. Given the relatively small volume of cigar boxes, probably not a big deal with that little gas, but still, i'm curious.

Not sure I follow you, Nitrogen is an inert gas, Time to go back to Freshman ROTC chemistry class. Can’t imagine why you would need to do any of this. Your cigars already contain plenty of Nitrogen since the atmosphere is like 76 to 80% Nitrogen anyways and it is the most abundant gas on Earth.

perkinke · February 2014

FireRob:
perkinke:
but wonder about the effect of nitro penetrating the cigars and if they would need to be outgassed or purged somehow. Given the relatively small volume of cigar boxes, probably not a big deal with that little gas, but still, i'm curious.
Not sure I follow you, Nitrogen is an inert gas, Time to go back to Freshman ROTC chemistry class. Can’t imagine why you would need to do any of this. Your cigars already contain plenty of Nitrogen since the atmosphere is like 76 to 80% Nitrogen anyways and it is the most abundant gas on Earth.

Exactly, inert, does not react, does not burn. So when you replace a vessels ENTIRE air content with an inert gas, and you have to do that with a fair bit of pressure, it ceases to contain that lovely little combustible element called oxygen. So, cigars being porous and under an unknown amount of pressure would absorb and retain the nitrogen and i don't know how long that would take to replace the atmospheric content in a cigar nor how long it would take to expel that replaced air and take back in our friend oxygen so that it lights and burns properly. All sorts of things CAN screw up a stick's burn, part of the question with this process was whether this is one of those things that MAY do that.

kuzi16 · February 2014

macs-smokes:
The only benefit I can think of for nitrogen... is kill beetles. Lack of oxygen... other than that... meh

even the Cubans are getting on board with freezing cigars now. this is becoming less and less of an issue as the years pass by.

0patience · February 2014

The thing about gases is that they dilute out rather quickly.
Air, being combined gases will absorb nitrogen fairly fast.
With in 5 minutes, the pure nitrogen will dilute out into the air.
Even pure nitrogen gas being pumped over volatile liquids to prevent explosions have to be continuously pumped on to the liquid to prevent dilution in an open vat.

Even a bag pumped full of nitrogen with a 10 mm leak will displace with air with in an hour.
Provided it doesn't collapse of course.

Dalton's Law of Partial Pressure shows this.
Because Nitrogen's partial pressure (.78083 atmospheric pressure) is less than combined air, combined air wishes to displace it if given the opportunity.

I apologize if this is way more info than you wanted, but thought it might help understand the physics of it.

Nitrogen/Vacuum Packing

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