IMO Sam Bacile is an Idiot

Freedom of Speech! Perhaps more outrage should be put towards the Libyans. I find it hard to believe that a group of thugs could get into the US Embassy so easily. Our Marines would never let that happen. The operatives were escorted in by the Libyan Gov. IMO.

Uh-oh, here it comes. Everyone on the CCOM forums is about to become a 1st Amendment Scholar.

JDH:

kuzi16:

The Kid:

IMO Sam Bacile is an idiot and should be brought up on charges of inciting a riot and involuntary manslaughter.
http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/12/13824089-us-ambassador-3-others-killed-in-attacks-on-libya-mission?lite

Bullshit.

the only people who should be in hot water over this is the people that actually killed other people.
poor speech does not give a right to riot and kill. there is no justification for that no matter how stupid the speech was.

just because someone calls my belief system stupid, irrational, barbaric, or any other number of horrible things does not mean that they are at fault for my actions.
personal responsibility is still at play here.

in a civil society, when someone uses their free speech to disagree with me i have my free speech to defend myself and rational people can decide who is right. Civil people do not riot over an insult.

When lies inspire religous zealots to violence, neither party is blameless; not the liar who excersiced his "free speech", or the intolerant religious bigots who commited the crimes. What that guy did was worse than standing up in a closed theatre and screaming FIRE! What those rioters did was exactly what we can expect from bigoted, religious Muslim fanatics.

You assume he's lying?

I just want to go on record in saying that I think everyone involved in this mess is a total @sshole. This Bacile guy...yes, he is protected by the 1st Amendment, but he's a total douche. Did he really think there would be no backlash? Not to mention, I saw the 13 minute trailer, and it looks like a pack of special needs 8th graders made it. It's awful. I think he's a coward too, as I understand it he's apparently in hiding right now.. His movie investors are cowards too. If they had any real convictions, they wouldn't be staying so annonymous.

That being said, the Libyans involved in that riot are all @ssholes, too. The whole Middle East needs to learn to chill. Take a continent wide anger management course, read some Mitch Albom novels, Ben & Jerry's free cone day....ANYTHING to lighten these guys up. In the words of the great Rob Delaney about 15 minutes ago on Twitter, "No movie, regardless of its message, can be used as justification for murder. Not even if it stars Kevin James."

JDH:

beatnic:

JDH:

kuzi16:

The Kid:

IMO Sam Bacile is an idiot and should be brought up on charges of inciting a riot and involuntary manslaughter.
http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/12/13824089-us-ambassador-3-others-killed-in-attacks-on-libya-mission?lite

Bullshit.

the only people who should be in hot water over this is the people that actually killed other people.
poor speech does not give a right to riot and kill. there is no justification for that no matter how stupid the speech was.

just because someone calls my belief system stupid, irrational, barbaric, or any other number of horrible things does not mean that they are at fault for my actions.
personal responsibility is still at play here.

in a civil society, when someone uses their free speech to disagree with me i have my free speech to defend myself and rational people can decide who is right. Civil people do not riot over an insult.

When lies inspire religous zealots to violence, neither party is blameless; not the liar who excersiced his "free speech", or the intolerant religious bigots who commited the crimes. What that guy did was worse than standing up in a closed theatre and screaming FIRE! What those rioters did was exactly what we can expect from bigoted, religious Muslim fanatics.

You assume he's lying?

Although I have not seen the movie, I am convinced that it is pure political propaganda of the worst sort, which does in fact, include the use of outright lies.

From the Wall St. Journal:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444017504577645681057498266.html

i do understand what you are saying JDH. it should not have been said. it was in poor taste but that is still no reason to kill.

edit:
the grey area here is that a right to free speech does not include the right to insight violence. that is a violation of the rights of the people the violence is perpetrated on.
so then the question here is did the movie makers insight violence on purpose or was this just an opinion piece?

and what about "Draw Mohammad Day"?

there is no right to not be offended
there is a right to life.
killing someone violates the right to life
saying something stupid (not purposely insighting violence) violates no rights.

According to this, these attacks were coordinated. They just used the film for propaganda purposes. How's that "Arab Spring" thing workin out for you, Mr. O.?

http://wtop.com/215/3033617/Officials-Embassy-attack-in-Libya-was-coordinated

JDH:

beatnic:

According to this, these attacks were coordinated. They just used the film for propaganda purposes. How's that "Arab Spring" thing workin out for you, Mr. O.?

http://wtop.com/215/3033617/Officials-Embassy-attack-in-Libya-was-coordinated

This is not about the President of the US, or the American Government, or the American people - they are not at fault here, and have done nothing wrong regarding this incident.

This is about a group of political / religious extremists who have deliberately incited another group of political / religious extremists, and the former put the USA squarely in the middle, for purely political reasons, I believe. This kind of behavior would make it tough for ANY sitting President just a few months out from an election.

If you love your country, I think the best thing to do is to support your country in time like this, not find fault with the President for something he didn't do.

Excuse me. He just lost 2 fricking Embassies to Islamic Radicals, let in by the host countries, and now is is offering apologies to those countries? Those Embassies are to be protected by the home country and they weren't. And he holds no animosity to those governments for letting them get attacked. And he's giving them our money!. George Bush would have been run out of town by now. This is a disgrace. How is it that you are so accommodating to radical, barbaric Islamics who kill people, but are so quick to ridicule Christians for voicing their beliefs? Yes, I do find fault with my president who, in my opinion, has let this anti-American attitude to fester. And I find fault with him for not seeing to the safety of our diplomats. And I find fault with his lame reaction. This will cause other countries to do the same thing. Is he doing anything now to prevent that? No. Wake up and realize that this is actually what he wants, a diminished USA. He has said as much. Listen to him. Listen to the radicals. Believe them. Or cover your ears. Sorry JDH. You were just the one to write it. Nothing personal. Peace.

No problem. Make a statement, apologize, go to Vegas
Excuse me everyone, but isn't an attack on an Embassy an act of war? Don't tell me it was just radical thugs. This was set up by the governments. Wake up.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/obamas-going-las-vegas

The Kid:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

According to this, these attacks were coordinated. They just used the film for propaganda purposes. How's that "Arab Spring" thing workin out for you, Mr. O.?

http://wtop.com/215/3033617/Officials-Embassy-attack-in-Libya-was-coordinated

This is not about the President of the US, or the American Government, or the American people - they are not at fault here, and have done nothing wrong regarding this incident.

This is about a group of political / religious extremists who have deliberately incited another group of political / religious extremists, and the former put the USA squarely in the middle, for purely political reasons, I believe. This kind of behavior would make it tough for ANY sitting President just a few months out from an election.

If you love your country, I think the best thing to do is to support your country in time like this, not find fault with the President for something he didn't do.

Excuse me. He just lost 2 fricking Embassies to Islamic Radicals, let in by the host countries, and now is is offering apologies to those countries? Those Embassies are to be protected by the home country and they weren't. And he holds no animosity to those governments for letting them get attacked. And he's giving them our money!. George Bush would have been run out of town by now. This is a disgrace. How is it that you are so accommodating to radical, barbaric Islamics who kill people, but are so quick to ridicule Christians for voicing their beliefs? Yes, I do find fault with my president who, in my opinion, has let this anti-American attitude to fester. And I find fault with him for not seeing to the safety of our diplomats. And I find fault with his lame reaction. This will cause other countries to do the same thing. Is he doing anything now to prevent that? No. Wake up and realize that this is actually what he wants, a diminished USA. He has said as much. Listen to him. Listen to the radicals. Believe them. Or cover your ears. Sorry JDH. You were just the one to write it. Nothing personal. Peace.

I agree partly with this, No Apologies should be issued,, JDH was correct in that America has been placed in a precarious position by two extremist factions. I am surprised with the recent conflict in Lybia, we didnt have marines on the ground at the embassy. A shame we couldnt of sortied a couple A-10's to provide air/ground support, An attack on a US embassy is an attack on American soil. I dont think blame falls on the President maybe more the state department or Secretary of State Clinton

Although I will not take an official stance on this subject, I will lend a little information to it. Every US Embassy is protected by Marines. However, it is always a small contingent designed only to protect the ambassador. The reason there is not a large presence is because we do not want to give the impression to other countries that we are weak. Sorry excuse I know, but that is a big reason behind it. With the Libya ordeal, it occured too fast for any official response from the floating task force always present in the Gulf for things like this. It is sad, good people have been lost.

The Kid:

I dont think it was set up by the governments, more of an opportunity that was further exploited by terrorist. I also think this shouldnt be spun by the Republican party to condemn Obama,, and Im a registered republican,, who I might add will not vote for Romney

Have participants faced any retribution from their government? I'm still wondering why we haven't heard the stories of Marines engaged in firefights, along with local governments. trying to protect a USA Embassy. Doesn't sound right. I think this was facilitated. Even the stupid movie thing. Its been out for months. The 12 minute clip is on fricken Ebay. Why now?

marineatbn03:

The Kid:

beatnic:

JDH:

beatnic:

According to this, these attacks were coordinated. They just used the film for propaganda purposes. How's that "Arab Spring" thing workin out for you, Mr. O.?

http://wtop.com/215/3033617/Officials-Embassy-attack-in-Libya-was-coordinated

This is not about the President of the US, or the American Government, or the American people - they are not at fault here, and have done nothing wrong regarding this incident.

This is about a group of political / religious extremists who have deliberately incited another group of political / religious extremists, and the former put the USA squarely in the middle, for purely political reasons, I believe. This kind of behavior would make it tough for ANY sitting President just a few months out from an election.

If you love your country, I think the best thing to do is to support your country in time like this, not find fault with the President for something he didn't do.

Excuse me. He just lost 2 fricking Embassies to Islamic Radicals, let in by the host countries, and now is is offering apologies to those countries? Those Embassies are to be protected by the home country and they weren't. And he holds no animosity to those governments for letting them get attacked. And he's giving them our money!. George Bush would have been run out of town by now. This is a disgrace. How is it that you are so accommodating to radical, barbaric Islamics who kill people, but are so quick to ridicule Christians for voicing their beliefs? Yes, I do find fault with my president who, in my opinion, has let this anti-American attitude to fester. And I find fault with him for not seeing to the safety of our diplomats. And I find fault with his lame reaction. This will cause other countries to do the same thing. Is he doing anything now to prevent that? No. Wake up and realize that this is actually what he wants, a diminished USA. He has said as much. Listen to him. Listen to the radicals. Believe them. Or cover your ears. Sorry JDH. You were just the one to write it. Nothing personal. Peace.

I agree partly with this, No Apologies should be issued,, JDH was correct in that America has been placed in a precarious position by two extremist factions. I am surprised with the recent conflict in Lybia, we didnt have marines on the ground at the embassy. A shame we couldnt of sortied a couple A-10's to provide air/ground support, An attack on a US embassy is an attack on American soil. I dont think blame falls on the President maybe more the state department or Secretary of State Clinton

Although I will not take an official stance on this subject, I will lend a little information to it. Every US Embassy is protected by Marines. However, it is always a small contingent designed only to protect the ambassador. The reason there is not a large presence is because we do not want to give the impression to other countries that we are weak. Sorry excuse I know, but that is a big reason behind it. With the Libya ordeal, it occured too fast for any official response from the floating task force always present in the Gulf for things like this. It is sad, good people have been lost.

Thanks for your perspective. So, its' not like on TV? I just find this whole this odd.

marineatbn03:

Most embassies have fewer than a platoon size element. Pretty small in the big scheme of things.

Truth. Now a Company of Marines....watch out